Olá, Visitante. Por favor entre ou registe-se se ainda não for membro.

Entrar com nome de utilizador, password e duração da sessão
 

Autor Tópico: Grécia - Tópico principal  (Lida 1840179 vezes)

D. Antunes

  • Ordem dos Especialistas
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 5284
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #420 em: 2015-02-01 19:05:19 »
Com um excedente orçamental primário a Grécia tem de momento a faça e o queijo na mão.

Juntando o facto de 170% do dívida ser impagável, o perdão ou repúdio está a caminho.

Claro que pode sempre cortar os dedos.

Ter excedente primário significa simplesmente que começa a pagar PARTE dos juros. Até agora não amortizava nada, pagava os juros contraindo mais dívida e ainda pedia anualmente mais algum. Agora continua sem reduzir a dívida mas já paga parte dos juros, não todos e com taxas muito baixas. É de facto indesculpável, a Europa tem sido extremamente cruel para estes meninos.
“Price is what you pay. Value is what you get.”
“In the short run the market is a voting machine. In the long run, it’s a weighting machine."
Warren Buffett

“O bom senso é a coisa do mundo mais bem distribuída: todos pensamos tê-lo em tal medida que até os mais difíceis de contentar nas outras coisas não costumam desejar mais bom senso do que aquele que têm."
René Descartes

vbm

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 13828
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #421 em: 2015-02-01 19:23:47 »
[ ]
 Até agora não amortizava nada, pagava os juros contraindo mais dívida e ainda pedia anualmente mais algum. [ ]

Ou seja, nós ainda estamos assim!

tommy

  • Visitante
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #422 em: 2015-02-01 19:28:06 »
Com um excedente orçamental primário a Grécia tem de momento a faça e o queijo na mão.
Isso era ceteris paribus, mas rapidamente o saldo primário se esfuma com estes tipos ao leme, depois de uma reposição de medidas despesistas. Além de que ninguém no seu perfeito juízo mete um cêntimo de investimento naquele país enquanto não souber o que coisa vai dar.

E nem é só isso...por exemplo grandes projetos que se queiram meter...tchau. Afastados dos mercados;
Crédito às empresas...tchau.

Importações....tchau.

Paraíso Coreia do Norte...só que na Europa.

Happy_TheOne

  • Ordem dos Especialistas
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 6653
  • I have a problem.I'm getting better at everything
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #423 em: 2015-02-01 19:47:51 »

vbm

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 13828
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #424 em: 2015-02-01 19:49:06 »
[ ]
Paraíso Coreia do Norte...só que na Europa.

O que não vai convir!

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #425 em: 2015-02-01 19:59:50 »
O iluminado deste país .....

http://www.publico.pt/mundo/noticia/o-espectro-que-assola-a-europa-1684558?page=-1


isso quer dizer que o artigo é bom? ou o contrário?

já agora:

O espectro que assola a Europa
JOSÉ PACHECO PEREIRA 31/01/2015 - 07:19

Passou uma semana desde que o Syriza ganhou as eleições na Grécia, quase com maioria absoluta, com um programa anti-troika e anti-austeritário, logo a seguir aliou-se com outro partido nacionalista e anti-troika, e no dia seguinte o seu líder visitou um memorial dos fuzilados na guerra contra a ocupação alemã, negociou com o Arcebispo Ieronymos de Atenas uma dupla cerimónia de juramento do governo grego, uma laica para os ministros ateus ou agnósticos e outra religiosa para os ministros cristãos, e ainda não pôs gravata. E começou a tempestade europeia, abrindo caminho a políticas distintas das dos últimos anos impostas pela Alemanha. Espero que tudo termine em bem para os gregos e que isso ajude a mudar a Europa que bem precisa. Para que haja contágio.

Se eu quiser descrever o que se passou de outra forma posso fazê-lo. Passou uma semana desde que um partido radical da extrema-esquerda ganhou as eleições na Grécia, mas não conseguiu a maioria absoluta, com um programa que quer a Grécia a mandriar e os gregos na boa vida, e os outros países da Europa a pagar a factura, logo a seguir aliou-se com um partido de extrema-direita, à direita do CDS, foi homenagear os guerrilheiros comunistas, e rompeu as obrigações que tinha com a Constituição grega, que definem a Grécia como tendo uma religião de estado, e com um primeiro-ministro que é mal-educado e não sabe vestir a roupa própria para cerimónias protocolares. E começou a tempestade grega, com os gregos a irem provar o fel de terem escolhido uns energúmenos demagogos para se governarem. Desejo que tudo se faça para que a “minha” política alemã “inevitável”, “sem alternativa”, não venha a ser posta em causa e que os gregos paguem duramente o preço da sua aventura, para que tudo continue na mesma. Para que haja vacina.

Basta comparar estas duas versões, para se perceber o grau de radicalização que hoje implica mudar, na Europa, como se as relações de poder tivessem ficado congeladas num momento da história recente e ninguém quisesse partir essa redoma de gelo. E foi mesmo isso que aconteceu. De há uns anos para cá, ou melhor desde que a Alemanha abriu a crise das dívidas soberanas, que é uma “construção” política artificial, escolhida, desejada e desencadeada, lançada às feras dos mercados, de natureza muito diferente da crise bancária suscitada pelos activos tóxicos e pela derrocada do Lehman Brothers, que a mudança parecia impossível. Num pequeno espaço de tempo, a União Europeia ensaiou uma resposta keynesiana, de injectar dinheiro nas economias para impedir que a crise bancária fizesse estragos consideráveis numa Europa sob assalto tóxico, seguida de imediato de um travão a fundo e do prosseguimento de duras políticas austeritárias, escolhendo uma linguagem punitiva para apontar os alvos. Começou pela Grécia e depois foi Portugal, esteve para ser a Espanha e a Itália.

Estava tudo bem nesses países? Não, não estava nada bem, mas a abertura artificial da “crise das dívidas soberanas” tornou tudo pior, porque impediu de imediato que esses países acedessem aos mercados e tornou-nos dependentes das políticas que levaram à troika. A relação de causa efeito não é entre os descalabros orçamentais e as dívidas cada vez mais altas desses países e os “resgates”, mas entre a criação de um novo tipo de crise com as dívidas soberanas dos estados, que infectaram os mercados e deram origem aos resgates. Nesse processo, acabou o directório, que já era uma perversão do funcionamento da União Europeia e passou-se ao exercício do poder único da Alemanha, que mudou de aliados na Europa. Deixou a França apagar-se cada vez mais e ligou-se aos países pequenos da linha dura anti-PIGs, como a Finlândia ou a Holanda.

Ou seja, a crise das dívidas soberanas permitiu a hegemonia alemã, que a Alemanha usou para impor um Tratado Orçamental que tornava rígida a sua política em toda a União Europeia, impediu o Banco Central Europeu de avançar com qualquer outra solução alternativa para conter a crise, e fez tudo para bloquear qualquer esboço de resistência à sua política. O Reino Unido isolou-se ainda mais, a França enfraqueceu-se, a Espanha conseguiu in extremis não seguir os PIGs, a Itália permaneceu na corda bamba, a Irlanda, Portugal e Grécia subjugaram-se em desespero de causa. Os socialistas traíram um pouco por todo o lado, assinando o Tratado Orçamental, aliando-se como parceiros menores aos vários governos alemães, e, quando tinham sido eles a estarem no poder no momento dos resgastes, ou foram reduzidos a partidos menores ou desapareceram do mapa dos grandes partidos, como aconteceu com o PASOK. Não havia “alternativa”, embora desde o início, essas alternativas surgissem, mas foram descartadas como exercícios de irrealismo político quase subversivo. Uma política genuinamente radical, como a que foi seguida por vários países europeus, como é o caso do governo português, passou a ocupar o “centro político”, o “arco da governação”. Eles é que eram radicais, mas chamavam radicais a todos os que lhe contestavam a “inevitabilidade”. No intervalo, países que seguiram outras receitas para combater a crise, passaram quase a bolchevistas, como era o caso dos EUA.

Era só uma questão de tempo até que outros verdadeiros radicais acabassem por vir tomar o lugar dos partidos social-democratas, democratas-cristãos, centristas, que cederam aos diktats alemães.  Cresceram os partidos democráticos, conservadores e eurocépticos, como UKIP, que, como contestava a ortodoxia europeia, passou também a ser considerado radical. Mas cresceram os partidos de direita mais extrema, como a Frente Nacional e partidos neo-nazis, que deixam  Marine Le Pen num altar de moderação, como é o caso da Aurora Dourada na Grécia. E cresceu o Syriza e o Podemos. Mas, mais significativo do que tudo isso, todos traduziram as tendências crescentes do eleitorado de muitos países de recusar a deriva anti-democrática da União Europeia, e a hegemonia das políticas alemãs de austeridade punitiva. Se hoje a União, como está, fosse a votos, na maioria dos países, não passava no eleitorado.

As pessoas sabem disso, os governantes que estão irresponsavelmente a destruir a União como ela existia, também sabem. A União Europeia não sobrevive à substituição de uma política de coesão e de interesse mútuo pela pergunta pavloviana dos novos mestres: “quem é que paga?”. É que antes também só alguns pagavam, mas percebiam que a construção da Europa era uma vantagem política para todos, e que o preço era pequeno. Pagavam desmandos? Pagavam e sabiam que pagavam, quer fosse a falcatrua das contas gregas quer fossem os privilégios dos agricultores franceses. Hoje quem pergunta “quem paga?”, para depois dizer que não quer pagar para esses preguiçosos do sul, está a usufruir das vantagens da União, a garantir que o euro é uma nova versão do seu marco, ou que os mercados a leste lhes estão abertos como nunca estiveram desde o tempo nefasto do Generalgouvernement, ou que puderam beneficiar do fim da guerra fria sem grandes turbulências à porta. Desequilibrem a Europa e depois admirem-se de Putin estabilizar as suas conquistas a Leste; dividam a Europa entre os amigos da austeridade e os seus inimigos e depois queixem-se de muitos segundos ou terceiros partidos serem extremos, anti-europeus, populistas, radicais; aticem os mercados contra os “que se portam mal” e depois queixem-se de haver saídas do euro, e queixem-se ainda mais se elas se revelarem vantajosas a prazo.

Ninguém pode garantir que o Syriza tenha sucesso, e também não é fácil definir qual o grau de cumprimento das suas intenções que possa ser considerado pelos gregos um sucesso, mas os gregos que votaram no  Syriza prestaram um enorme serviço à Europa, desbloquearam-na, abriram novas possibilidades, umas boas e outras más. Os gregos fizeram história, no sentido de que quem conhece a história sabe que ela é sempre surpresa. É por isso que, como na célebre frase de 1848, um espectro assola a Europa: o do Syriza.


Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #427 em: 2015-02-01 20:05:43 »
Entretanto, num outro site ;)


It's Greece Vs Wall Street
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 02/01/2015 11:52 -0500

Submitted by Raul Ilargi Meijer via The Automatic Earth blog,

On the one hand, I’ve written so much about Greece lately I fear I’m reaching overkill. On the other hand, there’s so much going on with Greece, and so fast, that I wouldn’t know here to begin. Moreover, I’m thinking and trying to figure what is what and what is actually happening so much it’s hard to stay focused for more than a short while before something else happens again and it all starts all over. And I’m thinking it must feel that way for the Syriza guys as well.

One thing I do increasingly ponder is that it gets ever harder to see the eurozone survive. In its present shape and form, that is. Damned if you do, doomed if you don’t, is an expression I’ve used before. It’s like this big experiment that a bunch of power hungry Europeans really get off on, that now all of a sudden is confronted with the democracy they all only thought existed in books of history anymore.

But if you take your blind hunger far enough to kill people, or ‘only’ condemn them to lives of misery, they will eventually try to speak up, even if not nearly soon enough. It’s like a law of physics, or like Icarus in, yes, Greek mythology: try to reach too high, and you’ll find you can’t.

What is Brussels supposed to do now? Throw Athens off a cliff? Not respect the voice of the Greek people? That doesn’t really rhyme with the ideals of the union, does it? If they want to keep the euro going, they’re going to have to give in to a probably substantial part of what Syriza is looking for. Or Greece will leave the eurozone, and bust it wide open, exposing its failures, its lack of coherence, and especially its lack of democratic and moral values.

The problem with giving in, though, is that there are large protest demonstrations in Spain and Italy too. Give anything at all to Greece, and the EU won’t be able to avoid giving it to others as well. And by then you’re talking real money.

They called it upon themselves. They got too greedy. They thought those starving Greek grannies would not be noticed enough to derail their big schemes. That claiming “much progress has been made”, as Eurogroup head Dijsselbloem did again this week, would be considered more important than the fact that an entire eurozone member nation has been thrown into despair.

That’s a big oversight no matter how you put it. The leadership can be plush and comfy in Berlin, Paris, Helsinki, but that doesn’t excuse them sporting blinders. And now they know. Or, let’s say, are beginning to know, because they still think they can ‘win this battle’, ostensibly with the aim of deepening the Greek misery even further, while continuing to proclaim that “much progress has been made”.

Not very smart. At least that much is obvious. But what else is? Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis declares in front of a camera that Greece ever paying back its full debt is akin to the Santa Claus story. Less than 24 hours later, PM Tsipras says of course Greece will pay back its debt. Varoufakis lashed out about Syriza not being consulted on EU sanctions against Russia, but shortly after their own Foreign Minister was reported to have said he reached a satisfactory compromise on the sanctions with his EU peers.

Discontent, confusion, or something worse, in the ranks? Hard to tell. What we can tell, however, is that the obvious discomfort with Dijsselbloem, Draghi, and the entire apparatus in Brussels – and Frankfurt – is a fake move. Either that or it’s only foreplay. If Yanis and Alexis want to get anywhere, they’ll need to take on Wall Street and its international, American, French, German, TBTF banks, primary dealers. And if there’s one thing those guys don’t like, it’s democracy.

Syriza is not really up against the EU or ECB, or the Troika, that’s a sideshow. They’re taking the battle to the IMF, a sort of silent partner in the Troika, and the organization that rules the world for the rich and the banks they own. And that, if they had paid a bit more attention and a bit less hubris, could have gone on the way they have, small squeeze after small squeeze, without hardly anyone noticing, until the end of – this – civilization. But no. It had to be more.

It’s going to be a bloody battle. And it hasn’t even started yet. But kudos to all Greeks for starting it. It has to be done. And I don’t see how the euro could possibly survive it.

bezanas

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Mensagens: 209
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #428 em: 2015-02-01 20:20:07 »
 é mazé a Grécia dos direitos adquiridos ...  da função publica e satélites contra os desempregados , trabalhadores temporários  e putos que andaram a estudar parvoeiras ... ensinadas por funcionários públicos parvos ... que nem emprego arranjam... 
a mema m q cá  :D


Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #429 em: 2015-02-01 20:27:33 »
poizé, poizé...


Incognitus

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 30961
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #430 em: 2015-02-01 21:04:14 »
Entretanto, num outro site ;)


It's Greece Vs Wall Street
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 02/01/2015 11:52 -0500

Submitted by Raul Ilargi Meijer via The Automatic Earth blog,

On the one hand, I’ve written so much about Greece lately I fear I’m reaching overkill. On the other hand, there’s so much going on with Greece, and so fast, that I wouldn’t know here to begin. Moreover, I’m thinking and trying to figure what is what and what is actually happening so much it’s hard to stay focused for more than a short while before something else happens again and it all starts all over. And I’m thinking it must feel that way for the Syriza guys as well.

One thing I do increasingly ponder is that it gets ever harder to see the eurozone survive. In its present shape and form, that is. Damned if you do, doomed if you don’t, is an expression I’ve used before. It’s like this big experiment that a bunch of power hungry Europeans really get off on, that now all of a sudden is confronted with the democracy they all only thought existed in books of history anymore.

But if you take your blind hunger far enough to kill people, or ‘only’ condemn them to lives of misery, they will eventually try to speak up, even if not nearly soon enough. It’s like a law of physics, or like Icarus in, yes, Greek mythology: try to reach too high, and you’ll find you can’t.

What is Brussels supposed to do now? Throw Athens off a cliff? Not respect the voice of the Greek people? That doesn’t really rhyme with the ideals of the union, does it? If they want to keep the euro going, they’re going to have to give in to a probably substantial part of what Syriza is looking for. Or Greece will leave the eurozone, and bust it wide open, exposing its failures, its lack of coherence, and especially its lack of democratic and moral values.

The problem with giving in, though, is that there are large protest demonstrations in Spain and Italy too. Give anything at all to Greece, and the EU won’t be able to avoid giving it to others as well. And by then you’re talking real money.

They called it upon themselves. They got too greedy. They thought those starving Greek grannies would not be noticed enough to derail their big schemes. That claiming “much progress has been made”, as Eurogroup head Dijsselbloem did again this week, would be considered more important than the fact that an entire eurozone member nation has been thrown into despair.

That’s a big oversight no matter how you put it. The leadership can be plush and comfy in Berlin, Paris, Helsinki, but that doesn’t excuse them sporting blinders. And now they know. Or, let’s say, are beginning to know, because they still think they can ‘win this battle’, ostensibly with the aim of deepening the Greek misery even further, while continuing to proclaim that “much progress has been made”.

Not very smart. At least that much is obvious. But what else is? Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis declares in front of a camera that Greece ever paying back its full debt is akin to the Santa Claus story. Less than 24 hours later, PM Tsipras says of course Greece will pay back its debt. Varoufakis lashed out about Syriza not being consulted on EU sanctions against Russia, but shortly after their own Foreign Minister was reported to have said he reached a satisfactory compromise on the sanctions with his EU peers.

Discontent, confusion, or something worse, in the ranks? Hard to tell. What we can tell, however, is that the obvious discomfort with Dijsselbloem, Draghi, and the entire apparatus in Brussels – and Frankfurt – is a fake move. Either that or it’s only foreplay. If Yanis and Alexis want to get anywhere, they’ll need to take on Wall Street and its international, American, French, German, TBTF banks, primary dealers. And if there’s one thing those guys don’t like, it’s democracy.

Syriza is not really up against the EU or ECB, or the Troika, that’s a sideshow. They’re taking the battle to the IMF, a sort of silent partner in the Troika, and the organization that rules the world for the rich and the banks they own. And that, if they had paid a bit more attention and a bit less hubris, could have gone on the way they have, small squeeze after small squeeze, without hardly anyone noticing, until the end of – this – civilization. But no. It had to be more.

It’s going to be a bloody battle. And it hasn’t even started yet. But kudos to all Greeks for starting it. It has to be done. And I don’t see how the euro could possibly survive it.


A opinião sobre o FMI é uma de quem não compreende para que é que o FMI serve. Não é para o que o senso comum pensa que é (e esse artigo reproduz a opinião do senso comum - o "FMI papão").
"Nem tudo o que pode ser contado conta, e nem tudo o que conta pode ser contado.", Albert Einstein

Incognitus, www.thinkfn.com

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #431 em: 2015-02-01 21:15:24 »
Entretanto, num outro site ;)


It's Greece Vs Wall Street
Submitted by Tyler Durden on 02/01/2015 11:52 -0500

Submitted by Raul Ilargi Meijer via The Automatic Earth blog,

On the one hand, I’ve written so much about Greece lately I fear I’m reaching overkill. On the other hand, there’s so much going on with Greece, and so fast, that I wouldn’t know here to begin. Moreover, I’m thinking and trying to figure what is what and what is actually happening so much it’s hard to stay focused for more than a short while before something else happens again and it all starts all over. And I’m thinking it must feel that way for the Syriza guys as well.

One thing I do increasingly ponder is that it gets ever harder to see the eurozone survive. In its present shape and form, that is. Damned if you do, doomed if you don’t, is an expression I’ve used before. It’s like this big experiment that a bunch of power hungry Europeans really get off on, that now all of a sudden is confronted with the democracy they all only thought existed in books of history anymore.

But if you take your blind hunger far enough to kill people, or ‘only’ condemn them to lives of misery, they will eventually try to speak up, even if not nearly soon enough. It’s like a law of physics, or like Icarus in, yes, Greek mythology: try to reach too high, and you’ll find you can’t.

What is Brussels supposed to do now? Throw Athens off a cliff? Not respect the voice of the Greek people? That doesn’t really rhyme with the ideals of the union, does it? If they want to keep the euro going, they’re going to have to give in to a probably substantial part of what Syriza is looking for. Or Greece will leave the eurozone, and bust it wide open, exposing its failures, its lack of coherence, and especially its lack of democratic and moral values.

The problem with giving in, though, is that there are large protest demonstrations in Spain and Italy too. Give anything at all to Greece, and the EU won’t be able to avoid giving it to others as well. And by then you’re talking real money.

They called it upon themselves. They got too greedy. They thought those starving Greek grannies would not be noticed enough to derail their big schemes. That claiming “much progress has been made”, as Eurogroup head Dijsselbloem did again this week, would be considered more important than the fact that an entire eurozone member nation has been thrown into despair.

That’s a big oversight no matter how you put it. The leadership can be plush and comfy in Berlin, Paris, Helsinki, but that doesn’t excuse them sporting blinders. And now they know. Or, let’s say, are beginning to know, because they still think they can ‘win this battle’, ostensibly with the aim of deepening the Greek misery even further, while continuing to proclaim that “much progress has been made”.

Not very smart. At least that much is obvious. But what else is? Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis declares in front of a camera that Greece ever paying back its full debt is akin to the Santa Claus story. Less than 24 hours later, PM Tsipras says of course Greece will pay back its debt. Varoufakis lashed out about Syriza not being consulted on EU sanctions against Russia, but shortly after their own Foreign Minister was reported to have said he reached a satisfactory compromise on the sanctions with his EU peers.

Discontent, confusion, or something worse, in the ranks? Hard to tell. What we can tell, however, is that the obvious discomfort with Dijsselbloem, Draghi, and the entire apparatus in Brussels – and Frankfurt – is a fake move. Either that or it’s only foreplay. If Yanis and Alexis want to get anywhere, they’ll need to take on Wall Street and its international, American, French, German, TBTF banks, primary dealers. And if there’s one thing those guys don’t like, it’s democracy.

Syriza is not really up against the EU or ECB, or the Troika, that’s a sideshow. They’re taking the battle to the IMF, a sort of silent partner in the Troika, and the organization that rules the world for the rich and the banks they own. And that, if they had paid a bit more attention and a bit less hubris, could have gone on the way they have, small squeeze after small squeeze, without hardly anyone noticing, until the end of – this – civilization. But no. It had to be more.

It’s going to be a bloody battle. And it hasn’t even started yet. But kudos to all Greeks for starting it. It has to be done. And I don’t see how the euro could possibly survive it.


A opinião sobre o FMI é uma de quem não compreende para que é que o FMI serve. Não é para o que o senso comum pensa que é (e esse artigo reproduz a opinião do senso comum - o "FMI papão").


não me pronunciei sobre a qualidade do artigo.
Achei interessante, isso sim, que fosse publicado no zerohedge. Que ultimamente tem estado empolgadíssimo com o Syriza.
Cognitive dissonance anyone?

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #432 em: 2015-02-01 21:17:20 »
aparentemente o primeiro contacto bilateral já deu frutos. O bom destas coisas é que são rápidas a acontecer.

France’s Socialist government offered support Sunday for Greece’s efforts to renegotiate debt for its huge bailout plan, amid renewed fears about Europe’s economic stability.

The backing was a victory for Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis, holding talks with European officials to push for new conditions on debt from creditors who rescued Greece’s economy to save the shared euro currency. Worries have mounted that Greece’s new far left government might not pay back its debts.

Varoufakis is also visiting London and Rome – and said Sunday that he would visit Berlin. The German government has been particularly angry at the new Greek government’s position and bluntly rejected suggestions that Greece should be forgiven part of its rescue loans.

Varoufakis insisted that Greece wants to pay the money back, but said he wants new terms and new negotiating partners, arguing that “it’s not worth” discussing with the so-called “troika” of creditors who set the strict terms for Greece’s rescue.

France’s Socialist leadership, whose president has campaigned against austerity, presented itself Sunday as a possible mediator between Greece and creditors.

French Finance Minister Michel Sapin insisted his country wouldn’t support canceling the debt, but offered support for a new timeframe or terms.

“France is more than prepared to support Greece,” Sapin said after meeting Varoufakis, saying Greece’s efforts to renegotiate were “legitimate.” Sapin urged a “new contract between Greece and its partners.”

Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras and his new government have worried financial markets and German and other European officials by pushing to scrap painful budget cuts and rethinking the debt. Tsipras sought to calm worries over the weekend after days of increasingly heated discussions.

Varoufakis announced that he has retained financial consultants Lazard as advisers to the Finance Ministry on issues of public debt and fiscal management. The socialist PASOK party, which ran Greece during part of its debt crisis, praised the decision, noting that then-Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos also hired Lazard advisers when he negotiated with private bondholders in 2011-2012.

france24

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #433 em: 2015-02-01 21:21:15 »
Obama says Greece needs growth, not more austerity
 
As representatives of the new Greek government begin a round of visits to eurozone countries, President Barack Obama has suggested that Greece will not be able to recover from its economic crisis unless there is a let up in austerity policies.

“You cannot keep on squeezing countries that are in the midst of depression,” when CNN’s Fareed Zakaria asked him about the case of Greece. “At some point, there has to be a growth strategy in order to pay off their debts and eliminate some of their deficits.

“There is no doubt that the economy of Greece was in dire need of reform,” he said in the interview broadcast on Sunday. “Tax collection was famously terrible. In order for Greece to compete in the world markets, they had to initiate a series of changes.”

However, the US president underlined that it is very difficult to carry out reforms when a country’s economy has contracted dramatically. Greece saw almost a quarter of its GDP disappear between 2008 and 2014.

“It’s very hard to initiate those changes if people’s standards of living are dropping by 25 percent,” he said. “Over time, the political system and society cannot sustain it.”

Obama also made reference to the compromise that would be needed by the SYRIZA-led coalition and the eurozone to reach a deal that would keep Greece in the single currency.

“My hope is that Greece will remain in the eurozone,” he told CNN. “I think that will require compromise on all sides. When the financial crisis in Greece flared up a few years ago, we were very active in trying to arrive at some sort of accommodation. I think there’s recognition on the part of Germany and others that it would be better for Greece to stay in the eurozone than be outside of it and the markets will obviously be skittish about this.”

Obama suggested that the eurozone needed to do more to stimulate growth and repeated that country’s that have been through deep recessions, such as Greece, should be assisted.

“More broadly I’m concerned about growth in Europe. Fiscal prudence is important, structural reforms are necessary in many of these countries but what we’ve learnt in the US experience... is that the best way to reduce deficits and restore fiscal soundness is to grow,” he said.

“When you have an economy that is in freefall there has to be a growth strategy and not simply an effort to squeeze more and more out of a population that is hurting worse and worse.”

kathimerini

Incognitus

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 30961
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #434 em: 2015-02-01 22:49:29 »
aparentemente o primeiro contacto bilateral já deu frutos. O bom destas coisas é que são rápidas a acontecer.

France’s Socialist government offered support Sunday for Greece’s efforts to renegotiate debt for its huge bailout plan, amid renewed fears about Europe’s economic stability.

The backing was a victory for Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis, holding talks with European officials to push for new conditions on debt from creditors who rescued Greece’s economy to save the shared euro currency. Worries have mounted that Greece’s new far left government might not pay back its debts.

Varoufakis is also visiting London and Rome – and said Sunday that he would visit Berlin. The German government has been particularly angry at the new Greek government’s position and bluntly rejected suggestions that Greece should be forgiven part of its rescue loans.

Varoufakis insisted that Greece wants to pay the money back, but said he wants new terms and new negotiating partners, arguing that “it’s not worth” discussing with the so-called “troika” of creditors who set the strict terms for Greece’s rescue.

France’s Socialist leadership, whose president has campaigned against austerity, presented itself Sunday as a possible mediator between Greece and creditors.

French Finance Minister Michel Sapin insisted his country wouldn’t support canceling the debt, but offered support for a new timeframe or terms.

“France is more than prepared to support Greece,” Sapin said after meeting Varoufakis, saying Greece’s efforts to renegotiate were “legitimate.” Sapin urged a “new contract between Greece and its partners.”

Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras and his new government have worried financial markets and German and other European officials by pushing to scrap painful budget cuts and rethinking the debt. Tsipras sought to calm worries over the weekend after days of increasingly heated discussions.

Varoufakis announced that he has retained financial consultants Lazard as advisers to the Finance Ministry on issues of public debt and fiscal management. The socialist PASOK party, which ran Greece during part of its debt crisis, praised the decision, noting that then-Finance Minister Evangelos Venizelos also hired Lazard advisers when he negotiated with private bondholders in 2011-2012.

france24


Portugal devia imediatamente pedir o mesmo, renegociar tudo. Estamos muito mais esmagados que os Gregos.
« Última modificação: 2015-02-01 22:49:39 por Incognitus »
"Nem tudo o que pode ser contado conta, e nem tudo o que conta pode ser contado.", Albert Einstein

Incognitus, www.thinkfn.com

Incognitus

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 30961
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #435 em: 2015-02-01 22:51:06 »
Obama says Greece needs growth, not more austerity
 
As representatives of the new Greek government begin a round of visits to eurozone countries, President Barack Obama has suggested that Greece will not be able to recover from its economic crisis unless there is a let up in austerity policies.

“You cannot keep on squeezing countries that are in the midst of depression,” when CNN’s Fareed Zakaria asked him about the case of Greece. “At some point, there has to be a growth strategy in order to pay off their debts and eliminate some of their deficits.

“There is no doubt that the economy of Greece was in dire need of reform,” he said in the interview broadcast on Sunday. “Tax collection was famously terrible. In order for Greece to compete in the world markets, they had to initiate a series of changes.”

However, the US president underlined that it is very difficult to carry out reforms when a country’s economy has contracted dramatically. Greece saw almost a quarter of its GDP disappear between 2008 and 2014.

“It’s very hard to initiate those changes if people’s standards of living are dropping by 25 percent,” he said. “Over time, the political system and society cannot sustain it.”

Obama also made reference to the compromise that would be needed by the SYRIZA-led coalition and the eurozone to reach a deal that would keep Greece in the single currency.

“My hope is that Greece will remain in the eurozone,” he told CNN. “I think that will require compromise on all sides. When the financial crisis in Greece flared up a few years ago, we were very active in trying to arrive at some sort of accommodation. I think there’s recognition on the part of Germany and others that it would be better for Greece to stay in the eurozone than be outside of it and the markets will obviously be skittish about this.”

Obama suggested that the eurozone needed to do more to stimulate growth and repeated that country’s that have been through deep recessions, such as Greece, should be assisted.

“More broadly I’m concerned about growth in Europe. Fiscal prudence is important, structural reforms are necessary in many of these countries but what we’ve learnt in the US experience... is that the best way to reduce deficits and restore fiscal soundness is to grow,” he said.

“When you have an economy that is in freefall there has to be a growth strategy and not simply an effort to squeeze more and more out of a population that is hurting worse and worse.”

kathimerini


É o mesmo que dizer que mais vale rico e com saúde do que pobre e doente.

E claro que todos os países se dariam melhor com crescimento. O problema é que o crescimento não vem de decretos  - nem das políticas que provocaram a dívida e déficits excessivos. O crescimento que essas políticas criam é temporário, e a dívida perdura (e os déficits em parte também)
"Nem tudo o que pode ser contado conta, e nem tudo o que conta pode ser contado.", Albert Einstein

Incognitus, www.thinkfn.com

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #436 em: 2015-02-01 22:57:12 »
Portugal devia imediatamente pedir o mesmo, renegociar tudo. Estamos muito mais esmagados que os Gregos.

Vai pedir e vai ter. Mas não com este governo, por certo. Para já o meme ainda é o do bom aluno. Esperemos que mude depressa. O governo e o meme.

Varoufakis

Visitante

  • Ordem dos Especialistas
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 3766
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #437 em: 2015-02-01 23:01:45 »
Com austeridade a dívida aumenta, é resgate atrás de resgate, entra-se num ciclo vicioso até à revolta social.

vbm

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Mensagens: 13828
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #438 em: 2015-02-01 23:14:41 »
Soromenho Marques, na reunião do Livre, denunciou que o apoio aos estados assistidos, Grécia, Irlanda, Portugal, Chipre, Espanha (banca) atingiu ao todo € 500 000 000 000. Ao conjunto dos  bancos europeus, o apoio foi dez vezes maior: € 5 000 000 000 000. Assim, se velam os prejuízos bolsistas e se sustenta a estagnaflação. 

Varoufakis

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Mensagens: 44
    • Ver Perfil
Re:Investir na Grécia
« Responder #439 em: 2015-02-01 23:17:04 »
comparação do GDP PPP

atenção às 'bocas' e dados falsos.

Var