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Autor Tópico: Ouro - Tópico principal  (Lida 246077 vezes)

Vanilla-Swap

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #220 em: 2013-04-16 18:01:05 »
ok fiz confusão.

obrigado

Vanilla-Swap

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #221 em: 2013-04-16 19:20:58 »

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #222 em: 2013-04-19 22:58:47 »
O problema dos saldos é que a mesma quantidade de dinheiro produz um maior estrondo.

Isso é desagradável para os bancos pois o crédito é fácil de criar [sacos dourados, no caso dos bullion banks], já a base é que não, principalmente quando se é um bullion bank e a base está em promoção.

É aí que a porca torce o rabo, pois a remoção da base aumenta a alavancagem do banco e por isso a racionalidade da corrida ao banco... Note-se que os bullion banks não têm o luxo de terem um banco central de último recurso, pois o padrão-ouro clássico está morto e enterrado.


Golden times for Perth Mint

April 17, 2013

http://www.smh.com.au/business/markets/golden-times-for-perth-mint-20130417-2hzv7.html

Gold sales from Perth Mint, which refines nearly all of the nation’s bullion, have surged after prices plunged, adding to signs that the metal’s slump to a two-year low is spurring increased demand.

“The volume of business that we’re putting through is way in excess of double what we did last week,” Treasurer Nigel Moffatt said, without giving precise figures. “There’s been people running through the gate.”

Bullion plunged 14 per cent in two sessions through April 15, the most since 1983, and the commodity has entered a bear market after losing 28 per cent from its record in 2011.

The recent slump was one of the largest corrections in modern history, Deutsche Bank said. However, gold is now poised to move higher as the physical market reacts, according to HSBC.

“There’s been significant sales made as people see this as great value,” Mr Moffatt said. “Gold owners are very reactive to significant market movements.”

Gold for immediate delivery, which slumped 9.1 per cent on Monday, climbed 0.9 per cent to $US1380.33 an ounce today. Prices, which peaked at $US1921.15, dropped as low as $US1321.95 yesterday, the lowest level since January 2011.

Gold’s drop has been excessive but there were still a lot of troubles out there, Dominic Schnider, head of commodities research at UBS, said today, citing the potential for a weaker dollar and debt concerns.

Still, the metal may drop to the so-called marginal cost of production at $US1150 if investment demand doesn’t return, Mr Schnider said.

Meanwhile, reports of strong demand for physical gold are coming in from across the region. Physical dealers have noted a shortage in gold bars because of the demand, pushing up premiums for gold bars in Singapore and Hong Kong, Reuters said today.

Japanese individual investors doubled gold purchases yesterday at Tokuriki Honten, the country’s second-largest retailer of the precious metal.

In India, the world’s largest gold consumer, the plunge may make bullion more affordable, said Mehul Choksi, chief executive of Gitanjali Gems, the nation’s biggest retailer of jewellery and diamonds by sales.

Sales from the Perth Mint may climb even as gold rebounds as some people wait for the price to advance before buying, Moffatt said. “We’ll see a fair bit of buying on renewed strength,” he said.

Chow Sang Sang’s gold-jewellery sales increased 50 per cent last weekend from the weekend before after prices slumped on April 12, Hong Kong’s Ming Pao Daily reported today, citing Lau Hak-bun, the company’s sales director.

The Perth Mint’s sales of gold coins climbed 49 per cent to 97,541 ounces in the three months ended March 31 from a year earlier, according to data from the facility in Western Australia that was founded in 1899.

The sell-off in gold was sparked by investor concern that European governments may have to follow Cyprus in selling part of their holdings and exacerbated as the metal fell below so-called technical-support levels, Goldman Sachs said yesterday. BlackRock said that it was a “panic event”.
« Última modificação: 2013-04-19 23:03:13 por hermes »
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

Visitante

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #223 em: 2013-04-20 15:50:07 »

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #224 em: 2013-04-20 17:30:23 »
O mercado do ouro é dois em um, i.e. os ocidentais e os orientais compram coisas diferentes a que chamam ouro.

Para um ocidental, o ouro é preço. Logo qq papel que siga o preço "is as good as gold".

Para um oriental, o ouro é o método de poupaça testado pelo tempo e que ao mesmo tempo é uma excelente forma de ostentar a riqueza sem a consumir, seja colocando-o ao pescoço, pendurando-o no nariz ou vestindo-o:



Este choque de conceitos cria uma dinâmica engraçada, pois a concepção ocidental evade a lei da oferta e da procura, na medida em que a procura com prazer é satisfeita com crédito/dinheiro e isso não é problema para um Banco Central. Ou seja, no Ocidente há um Banco Central de último recurso para o "ouro".

A mosca no unguento está em que os orientais querem ouro e não "ouro". Além disso, ao contrário dos ocidentais têm a mania de comprar ouro quando este está barato:



Pior ainda, são compradores em volume monetário disponível para poupanças e não em peso:



Porém ao contrário do mercado do "ouro", o mercado do ouro não tem um Banco Central de último recurso. Posto isto, observamos este choque de conceitos [e civilisações] bem como o fluxo do ouro na fila da frente com as nossas pipocas, sim?


Dip, dip hurray! Price slide spurs gold rush

By R. Ramabhadran Pillai
On April 17, 2013

http://m.thehindu.com/news/cities/Kochi/dip-dip-hurray-price-slide-spurs-gold-rush/article4624265.ece/

Consumers bolted to bag gold on Tuesday as the price of the precious metal hit a trough of Rs. 2,475 per gram (22 carat), a dip of Rs. 125.

In almost a year, it was for the first time that buyers could lay their hands on the metal for a price below Rs 20,000 per sovereign (8g)

But there are some customers holding themselves back expecting a further slide. The prices have been on the swing for over a fortnight. From Rs.2,780 on April 1, the price hit a low of Rs.2,600 on April 15. Gold had touched a historic high of Rs.3,000 per gram last year.

The steep slide has come as a relief to many customers during the wedding season as gold is still part of the dowry parents give to their daughters. People rushed to book gold at the present rate for purchases to be made months later as per schemes available at various jewellery outlets.

Jewellers say the time is ripe to buy gold. Further decline, if at all it happens, will be marginal and there is no scope for large erosion in prices, according to B.Govindan, working president of All Kerala Gold & Silver Merchants Association.

Cyprus has sold a few tonnes of gold; Italy and Spain are talking of selling their stock; but these are small in quantity in the overall global bullion scenario. Gold will continue to be in shortage as almost 80 per cent of yellow metal has been mined in gold mines across the world, Mr. Govindan says.

Will the rise in domestic demand give rise to more imports, which the government wants to discourage? There may not be much scope for a major shift, say industry experts.

There will be some pressure on imports, but the 6 per cent customs duty is a deterrent. Metals and Minerals Trading Corporation of India, the government agency involved in import and sale of gold, sells about 2 tonnes of gold to jewellers annually in Kerala. The figure is not bound to go up significantly, according to official sources. A prime reason is the entry of smuggled gold into the market.

One of the notable players in the present bullion scenario is the gold loan companies. A prominent company in the sector, based in Thrissur, has auctioned about 5 kg of gold ornaments last week. The ornaments, contained in about 1000 packets, were marked for sale on account of non-repayment of loan.

For such companies, future sale of similar commodity will be a matter to ponder over. Under the present situation which does not promise a jump in prices, the company may not be able to hold the defaulters’ gold for long. The unexpected shortfall is bound to affect the company’s profits as well. There has already been a dent in the share prices of these companies ever since the present golden slide show began.
« Última modificação: 2013-04-20 17:35:03 por hermes »
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

JoaoAP

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #225 em: 2013-05-21 15:50:56 »
Segundo este vídeo o  Rothschilds  controlam o mercado do Ouro.
Controlam mesmo? Alguém confirma?
The Rothschilds Control of World Gold Market
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLyGLZoGNr8

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #226 em: 2013-05-21 17:03:01 »
Desde o início do séc. XIX que os Rotschild negoceiam ouro, cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathan_Mayer_Rothschild.

Os Rotschild presidiram à criação do gold fixing em 1919 e este era feito na sede da N M Rothschild & Sons até 2004, cf. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_fixing.

Estes são dados concretos e públicos. Baseados neles, parece-me plausível que sim. Com isto não quero dizer que o controlo seja activo, mas sim que têm uma posição sistémica no mercado do ouro físico.


Correram dois rumores:

* O Brown's bottom serviu para salvar o pescoço dos Rotschild da implosão da sua pirâmide de "ouro" e o preço do salvamento foi a saída da LBMA.
* Tb correu o rumor não necessariamente independente de que estes abandonaram o titanic [LBMA] para protegerem o seu ouro.
« Última modificação: 2013-05-21 17:07:15 por hermes »
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

JoaoAP

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #227 em: 2013-05-21 17:25:22 »
Obrigado Hermes.

Isto do Ouro tem que se lhe diga...é os BB (bullion banks) o
LBMA (The LBMA is the international trade association that represents the wholesale market for gold and silver, which is centered in London but has a global client base. The ongoing work of the Association encompasses many areas, among them refining standards, good trading practices and standard documentation) tive de ir ao site...
coisas que descobri actualmente.
O hermes sabe deste assunto como ninguém, mas nunca liguei muito ao Ouro e começo a descobrir coisas que não fazia a mínima ideia de existirem.
A tese que defende de que não vão deixar os donos das minas em paz... faz agora mais sentido para mim.

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #228 em: 2013-05-26 17:27:00 »
Nações antigas têm o problema de há muito terem ultrapassado o "à terceira, só cai quem é burro". Segue-se o comportamento do governo indiano:



E no fim, o governo indiano vem dizer à sua populaça que esta se comporte!  :D

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Contain uncontrolled passion for gold: Chidambaram to countrymen

PTI : Mumbai, Sat May 25 2013, 11:47 hrs

http://www.indianexpress.com/news/contain-uncontrolled-passion-for-gold--chidambaram-to-countrymen/1120501/0

Finance Minister P Chidambaram today asked countrymen to contain their "uncontrolled passion" for gold and instead save in financial instruments. "Have faith in our financial sector. Unfortunately, we have difficulty shedding our old habits and put our money in gold," he said while speaking at an event to mark the platinum anniversary celebrations of state-run Dena Bank.

"The uncontrolled passion for gold must be contained," Chidambaram said and reeled out data to show how increasing gold imports are hurting the Current Account Deficit (CAD). People should rather switch to financial products to funnel their savings, the Minister said and added the soon to be launched inflation indexed bonds is a very lucrative option.

He also sought to demolish gold as a hedge against inflation, saying many such investors are finding the going difficult ever since the price of gold plummeted to Rs 26,000 from over Rs 33,000 per ten grams last year.

He said that last year the country bought USD 50 billion worth gold and fortunately, it was able to finance the CAD of USD 90 billion on the back of higher foreign flows and could maintain the foreign exchange reserves level at around USD 290 billion. However, if the flows were to stop completely, it would have a negative impact on the forex reserves, the minister warned.

Explaining the difficulties of financing a high CAD, which hit a record high of 6.7 per cent in the Decemeber quarter of last fiscal, as against the fiscal deficit, another problematic point, he said, the government can borrow from its people for the latter but has to depend on external flows for the latter.

The CAD, which is the excess of foreign exchange spent than earned, is likely to be over 5 per cent last fiscal. Chidambaram reiterated the government's commitment to rein in fiscal deficit at the targeted level of under 5.2 per cent last fiscal and 4.8 per cent this fiscal.

Speaking to reporters on the sidelines, Financial Services Secretary Rajiv Takru said it will take at least seven to ten days more before any action is taken by the Reserve Bank against errant banks in the money laundering probe initiated following a series of sting operations by the newsportal Cobrapost.

He said the problem is not so much with the "greed" of banks but lack of "inadequate attention to existing rules and regulations" which would be tightened. On bank recapitalization, Takru said a majority of the Rs 14,000 crore earmarked for recpaitalisation of public sector banks this fiscal will be provided in the fourth quarter while the request of a few of those which need capital early will also be considered.
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

JoaoAP

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #229 em: 2013-05-27 21:32:26 »
Está bonito...

Suppliers & Bank Clients Denied Gold As Shortage Intensifies
 
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Today Egon von Greyerz shocked King World News with more stunning news regarding clients having problems getting their physical gold out of Swiss banks as well as other major banks as the gold shortage intensifies.  Greyerz also discussed the fact that suppliers cannot keep up with demand and the reason will surprise KWN readers around the world.  Below is what Greyerz, who is founder of Matterhorn Asset Management out of Switzerland, had to say in this remarkable interview.

Greyerz:  “Eric, at our company we are hearing more and more stories about banks not delivering gold that belongs to the client.  We are talking about Swiss banks here once again.  One client went to a Swiss bank to inspect his gold and the client manager said, ‘You can’t see it, but it looks like this,’ and he took a gold bar out of his drawer.

And the client showed me that he had a statement showing ounces of gold.  Well, you don’t own physical gold in ounces in Europe.  You own gold bars either in grams or in kilos, but not in ounces....
...

Greyerz also added: “The latest shocking news from suppliers is they are having a very difficult time getting hold of physical gold.  Therefore, this week again they increased their spreads on physical gold.  So again, Eric, my message is very clear: Investors must hold physical gold outside of the banking system because this paper market will explode one day.”

Cotinue ... HERE
« Última modificação: 2013-05-27 21:33:03 por JoaoAprende »

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #230 em: 2013-06-01 20:11:28 »
aqui tinha mencionado que o volume dos contratos do ouro era mais compatível com o volume dos contratos de divisas do que com o volume dos contratos de commodities. Este e o próximo post servem para mostrar isso mesmo.

Segue-se a seguinte notícia acabada de divulgar pela LBMA e de outros dois snapshots no tempo:

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London Gold Trade Reached 20-Month High After Price Drop

By Whitney McFerron
2013-05-30T16:28:52Z

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-05-30/london-gold-trade-reached-20-month-high-after-price-drop.html


London Gold Trade Reached 20-Month High After Price Drop
By Whitney McFerron - 2013-05-30T16:28:52Z

London gold trading jumped to a 20-month high in April and silver volumes surged 25 percent after a plunge in prices for both precious metals spurred an increase in physical buying, the London Bullion Market Association said.

Trading in gold averaged 24.1 million ounces a day in the London market, the most for any month since August 2011, the LBMA said in a statement e-mailed today. The total compared with 21.8 million ounces a day in March. Silver volume was 165.2 million ounces a day, up from 132.5 million ounces in the previous month. There were 5,395 gold transactions on average per day, the highest on record, while silver transfers at 1,007 a day were the second-highest ever, according to the report.

Gold fell 14 percent in London in the two trading sessions ended April 15, the biggest drop in more than 30 years, on speculation that Cyprus or other European countries would sell holdings in the precious metal, the LBMA said. The price rebounded as much as 13 percent through early May as demand increased for gold coins and jewelry. Assets in exchange-traded funds backed by gold fell 18 percent this year to 2,152.7 metric tons yesterday, the lowest since June 2011, data compiled by Bloomberg show.

“April was characterized by continued offloading of both metals by ETF funds,” the LBMA said. “But this was more than offset by strong physical demand, particularly from India,” the world’s biggest consumer.

ETP Declines

Assets in exchange-traded funds backed by gold fell 174 metric tons in April, the biggest drop on record, data compiled by Bloomberg show. Silver ETF assets dropped by 1.4 percent in April and 2.3 percent in May.

Gold demand in India is set for a quarterly record as imports head for 300 to 400 tons in the second quarter, the World Gold Council said in a report yesterday.

Gold traded at $1,411.60 an ounce today in London, heading for a 4.4 percent loss in May, a second-straight decline. Prices are down 16 percent this year. Silver for immediate delivery was at $22.9425 an ounce, down 5.7 percent in May and 24 percent so far in 2013.

The value of gold transferred in April increased about 3 percent from the previous month to a daily average of $35.8 billion, the LBMA said. Silver values climbed about 9 percent to $4.17 billion a day.


O segundo snapshot é um excerpto de um artigo da wikipedia com a quantidade transaccionada em 2008. Este excerpto é bastante interessante por comparar também a produção mundial com a quantidade de contratos transaccionados.

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Although the physical market for gold and silver is distributed globally, most wholesale OTC trades are cleared through London. The average daily volume of gold and silver cleared at the London Bullion Market Association (LBMA) in November 2008 was 18.3 million ounces (worth $13.9 billion) and 107.6 million ounces (worth $1.1 billion) respectively. This means that an amount equal to the annual gold mine production was cleared at the LBMA every 4.4 days, and to the annual silver production every 6.2 days.[1] The Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee claims that clearing data substantially understates the true amount of gold traded, due to the netting of trades in the calculation of Clearing Statistics.[2] They claim the LBMA market is $5.4 trillion a year.
Fonte: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_bullion_market

E para não alegarem que isto são volumes de bullmarket ou até bolha, segue-se o snapshot de Janeiro de 1997 [4 anos antes do começo do bullmarket do ouro] quando o génio saiu da lâmpada.

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Gold global market revealed

By Kenneth Gooding, Mining Correspondent
THURSDAY JANUARY 30 1997

The London Financial Times

Deals involving about 30 million troy ounces, or 930 tonnes, of gold valued at more than $10 billion are cleared every working day in London, the international settlement centre for gold bullion. This is the first authoritative indication of the size of the global gold market, and was revealed yesterday by the London Bullion Market Association. With the blessing of the Bank of England, the association overturned years of tradition and secrecy to provide statistics illustrating the size and depth of the London market.

The volume of gold cleared every day in London represented nearly twice the production from South African mines in a year, Mr. Alan Baker, chairman of the association, pointed out. It was also equivalent to the amount of gold held in the reserves of European Union central banks. The size of the gold market will surprise many observers, but traders insisted the association’s statistics were only part of the picture because matched orders are cleared without appearing in the statistics. Mr. Jeffrey Rhodes, of Standard Bank, London, said the 30m ounces should be “multiplied by three, and possibly five, to give the full scope of the global market”.

Mr. Baker said the association would produce average daily clearance figures every month. “They will provide a useful benchmark for comparison and analysis of trends in the volume of the global bullion business,” he predicted. He denied suggestions that the move might drive business away from London by upsetting clients who preferred secrecy. “These figures do not in any way affect the confidentiality of the market. While discretion and integrity will always be bywords in the London bullion market, the LBMA is nevertheless conscious of the general call for greater transparency in markets. “The statistics demonstrate the prominence of London in the world of bullion, something we have long been aware of but which until now has been difficult to demonstrate with statistics.”

LBMA members were divided over the move. One said he was puzzled. “What will people make of it?” Another said the exercise was “futile” because it did not give a complete picture of bullion market activity. But Standard Bank’s Mr. Rhodes suggested the statistics would “become the key indicator in the world of gold, providing the numbers by which the market can be monitored”.

Mr. Martin Stokes, vice-chairman of the association, said: “This shows we have a serious market with a lot of depth and deserving of more attention.” The statistics showed, for example, that the 300 tonnes of gold sold recently by the Dutch central bank – a disposal that badly affected bullion market sentiment – was not a large amount by the market’s standards. The association was “making a bid to attract investors’ interest”.

The association also gave details yesterday about the silver market. Roughly 250 million ounces of silver valued at more than $1 billion are cleared daily in London. It also published the results of a Bank of England survey of turnover that the 14 market-making members of the LBMA in the London bullion market conducted in May last year. This showed about 7 million ounces of gold, worth nearly $3 billion, was traded daily by these market-makers.
Fonte: http://www.gold-eagle.com/gold_digest/baron907.html
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #231 em: 2013-06-01 20:35:08 »
Segue-se agora a segunda parte da justificar que o volume dos contratos de ouro transaccionados não é compatível com o volume dos contratos de commodities. Para o justificar, segue-se a seguinte notícia sobre a commodity mais importante e líquida de todas.

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UPDATE 1-Record 2.5 bln barrels of oil futures traded Tuesday

Wed Apr 14, 2010 9:58pm IST

http://in.reuters.com/article/2010/04/14/oil-record-volume-idINLDE63D28320100414

* Record 1.4 billion barrels trade on NYMEX in U.S.
* Further 1.1 billion trade on ICE in London

(Adds details on London trade, quotes)

LONDON, April 14 (Reuters) - A record 2.5 billion barrels of crude oil traded on April 13 on the world's two main futures exchanges, the equivalent of almost 30 times the amount of oil used around the world each day, data showed on Wednesday.

In the United States, a record 1.4 million benchmark U.S. crude oil CLc1 future contracts changed hands on the New York Mercantile Exchange (NYMEX), a spokesman for CME Group (CME.O) said on Wednesday, 25 percent more than the previous record set last week. Each contract is equal to 1,000 barrels.

In London, a further 1.1 million contracts traded, comprised of both U.S. crude and Brent crude oil futures -- the benchmark for much of Europe, Africa and Asia. The volume of U.S. crude oil futures traded in London was also a record for the exchange.

"This (total) volume, representing 2.5 billion barrels of crude oil, is roughly 29 times the daily volume in the physical market," analyst Tim Evans at Citigroup said.

An average of about 86 million barrels per day of crude oil are expected to be consumed globally this year. [IEA/M]

U.S. crude oil futures jumped $2 to near $86 a barrel on Wednesday, recovering after 5 days of losses. At one stage on Tuesday, U.S. crude oil futures were down by as much as 2 percent, before rallying into the close to finish the day just 29 cents down.

The spike in volumes is likely to be closely monitored by the Commodities Futures Trading Commission (CFTC) in the United States, which aims to rein in speculation in energy and commodity trading, especially oil.

Excessive speculation has been blamed for sending oil prices to record highs near $150 a barrel in 2008, though many traders, analysts and industry groups have argued higher trading volumes lead to less volatile prices.

In January, the CFTC unveiled proposed regulations on how many U.S. energy contracts hedge funds, investment banks and other speculators can control. The proposal is up for public comment until April 26. [ID:nCFTCREG]

Last Tuesday, U.S. crude prices hit an 18-month high of $87.09 a barrel, in a move some analysts and traders attributed to increased buying by funds at the start of the quarter, as well as growing demand as the world economy recovers.

The record volume on both exchanges includes contracts both for physical delivery in May and far in the future although the majority of the trades were on contracts for next month and June. (Reporting by David Sheppard; editing by Keiron Henderson)


Seguem-se agora os dois excerptos deste e do post anterior a provarem que o volume dos contratos sobre o ouro não é um volume sobre contratos de commodities:

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LONDON, April 14 (Reuters) - A record 2.5 billion barrels of crude oil traded on April 13 on the world's two main futures exchanges, the equivalent of almost 30 times the amount of oil used around the world each day, data showed on Wednesday.


Ou seja, por dia transacciona 1/12 da produção anual de petróleo.

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Although the physical market for gold and silver is distributed globally, most wholesale OTC trades are cleared through London. The average daily volume of gold and silver cleared at the London Bullion Market Association (LBMA) in November 2008 was 18.3 million ounces (worth $13.9 billion) and 107.6 million ounces (worth $1.1 billion) respectively. This means that an amount equal to the annual gold mine production was cleared at the LBMA every 4.4 days, and to the annual silver production every 6.2 days.[1] The Gold Anti-Trust Action Committee claims that clearing data substantially understates the true amount of gold traded, due to the netting of trades in the calculation of Clearing Statistics.[2] They claim the LBMA market is $5.4 trillion a year.


Ou seja, por dia transacciona 1/4 da produção anual de ouro.
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

SrSniper

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #232 em: 2013-06-01 23:57:18 »
Um gráfico do ouro é que era :)

Visitante

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #233 em: 2013-06-02 00:06:10 »

Visitante

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #234 em: 2013-06-15 01:11:27 »
John Paulson's Gold Fund Is Getting Absolutely Annihilated

Billionaire John Paulson's gold fund is down 54% year to date, according to an investor letter examined by Bloomberg.

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/paulsons-gold-fund-down-54-ytd-2013-6#ixzz2WEnrqvwB


O Gold Fund apostou em companhias de mineração de ouro e deu-se mal com o colapso do sector, que perde mais de 50% desde os máximos de meados de 2011.

JoaoAP

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #235 em: 2013-06-15 20:49:03 »
O hermes vai gostar disto... isto é... é o que ele tem vindo a alertar...

http://deutsche-wirtschafts-nachrichten.de/2013/06/14/bundestag-erhoeht-mehrwertsteuer-auf-silber-muenzen/

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France has outlawed buying or selling of precious metals for cash and has now outlawed even mailing them, In Germany, the Bundestag and the Bundesrat have decided to increase VAT on silver coins to 19% trying to make it unprofitable for investors to go out of the system using the tax increases. By the beginning of next year, Germany will be attacking the precious metals as well.

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Bundestag eo Bundesrat decidiram aumentar o IVA em moedas de prata. Por doze pontos percentuais os aumentos de impostos. Até o início do próximo ano, ainda é considerada a taxa de imposto mais favorável. Depois que o mercado alemão deve ser interessante para os investidores estrangeiros.

 

Tópicos: Governo Federal , da União Europeia , de ouro , de capital , impostos , moedas , prata na Alemanha, a compra de uma moeda Kookaburra australiano a partir do próximo ano vai ser mais caro

Discretamente Bundestag eo Bundesrat decidiram na semana passada para aumentar o IVA sobre as moedas de prata. Desde 1 Janeiro pode ser comprado em uma taxa mais baixa agora não mais moedas de prata.

Até o momento foi de moedas de prata da taxa reduzida de sete por cento . Este plano será aumentada para 19 por cento em 2014 para. A nova taxa de imposto aplica-se moedas de prata, como o Panda chinês, Australian Kookaburra, a Filarmônica de prata, mas também de moedas de colecção em prata . A mudança na taxa de IVA para as moedas de prata encontradas na Lei sobre a implementação da directiva relativa à assistência mútua e que altera a legislação tributária ( Lei de Implementação da Assistência , S. 44, § 12, § 2 º) . Prata não é mencionado diretamente, mas sim o termo "obras de arte e de colecção" é utilizado - e isso também mais perto de levantar aqui (. p. 44f)

Com esta inovação, o governo depende de uma directiva da UE, que especifica a harmonização das taxas de IVA. O benefício para o governo federal: as receitas fiscais mais altas são sempre bem-vindos e você definir algo como isto mais fácil para grupos de não ter um lobby forte da indústria, tais como o hotel ou a indústria automotiva. Então, beneficiou o estado dos investimentos empresariais.

No entanto, a política ainda não se atreveu a ouro. Ambos barras de ouro e moedas de ouro permanecem isentos de IVA . Até agora, isso é porque eles são vistos como um investimento. No entanto, isto pode mudar. Moedas de ouro com valor numismático (moedas de colecção) estão sujeitos ao imposto.

hermes

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #236 em: 2013-06-15 22:41:38 »
Sim, tenho vindo a alertar para isso, mas isso são episódios transientes do side show da política até passarmos para o além do sistema monetário presente [o padrão dólar & dívida como a reserva por excelência dos bancos centrais e dos aforradores].

A seu tempo os políticos aprenderão que a divisa do conservador e confiável Banco Central da Natureza tem de fluir livremente para poderem taxar a actividade económica e manterem o privilégio dos seus bancos centrais continuarem a ter uma impressora funcional.

Aliás, aposto que no além do sistema monetário presente os políticos abraçarão o ouro como a divisa que que substituirá o dólar, porém sem câmbio fixo, tal e qual agora onde as divisas tb não têm câmbio fixo entre si. Jamais os banqueiros centrais vão prescindir da liberdade ganha com a morte do padrão-ouro em 1971. A razão de tamanho entusiasmo por parte dos políticos  está no detalhe de que todas as moedas [umas bem mais do que outras] terão de desvalorizar fortemente relativamente ao ouro para que este possa cumprir a nova função de saldar balanças comerciais. Esse tamanho entusiasmo por parte dos políticos é por puro interesse, pois os seus respectivos bancos centrais têm lá uma coisa mantida por "tradição" a ganhar pó que então pode ser usada para saldar parte da dívida mantendo os bancos centrais uma boa parte do bolo ainda.

Vai ser tal e qual a preparação e entrada no euro com os políticos a abraçarem e a louvarem o novo sistema devido ao grande alívio no endividamento dos estados e as consequentes promessas sem custos a curto prazo que os políticos vão poder fazer nos primeiros anos... Até que os políticos seguintes se dêam conta que o novo activo sem risco do Banco Central da Natureza compete com a dívida que querem emitir... Pois é, a outra face da limpesa da dívida, é que uma ou duas gerações de aforradores, senão mais, estarão bastante renitentes a poupar em dívida pública... i.e. as moedas serão puramente transaccionais.

Voltando aos excertos, duvido que o ouro venha a ter IVA, pois este não existe por norma / tratados da própria União Europeia. Além disso essa ausência de taxas sobre o ouro tem implicações sistémicas e não estou a ver o BCE / Eurogrupo a abrir mão delas.
"Everyone knows where we have been. Let's see where we are going." – Another

ana

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #237 em: 2013-06-21 12:34:38 »
o ouro já desfez 2 anos e 9 meses de subidas. subidões destes, em alta volatilidade no mensal, são bolhas q depois dão nisto.
a ber q faz na sma do mensal se e qd lá for

Thunder

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #238 em: 2013-06-21 12:47:59 »
Ontem foi uma valente queda. Ainda pensei que fosse aguentar ali pelos 1280, mas ainda foi mais abaixo. Se hoje testar os mesmos níveis e estiver com sinais de aguentar talvez tente uma entrada pequena esperando um dead cat bounce
Nullius in Verba
Divide et Impera
Não há almoços grátis
Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored
Bulls make money, bears make money.... pigs get slaughtered

ana

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Re:Ouro - Tópico principal
« Responder #239 em: 2013-06-21 12:49:23 »
o perigo é a tua profissão:D