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Autor Tópico: Grécia - Tópico principal  (Lida 1837258 vezes)

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6940 em: 2015-07-04 17:07:10 »
Eu coloquei este gráfico a ilustrar esse post, entretanto já respondeste pelo que repito.

de acordo. a tua opinião está claríssima.
dentro de pouco tempo saberemos qual está correcta.

L
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

Reg

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6941 em: 2015-07-04 17:09:58 »
humanidade avanca sempre  com  meia duzia paises  com moeda forte.


portugal ja foi um deles nos descobrimentos


o desvalorizar  nao e para todos.
Democracia Socialista Democrata. igualdade de quem berra mais O que é meu é meu o que é teu é nosso

valves1

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6942 em: 2015-07-04 17:51:33 »
Citar
Ludek Niedermayer, who headed the risk management department at the Czech central bank when the Czech koruna was introduced in February 1993, said that at the time his country and Slovakia were relatively isolated, having emerged from communism less than four years earlier. Greece, he noted, is far more integrated into the Europe, making it harder to switch.

eu sou nao percebo porque e que se insiste  na ideia de que a Grecia deve seguir exemplos  paises como a Eslovaquia   ou a estonia como se isso fosse possivel de um dia para o outro ou mesmo em 10 anos;
A Eslovaquia praticamente triplicou  GDP - real growth rate nos ultimos 10 anos a Estonia teve uma performance ligeiramente pior mas mesmo assim multiplicou por 2 X o GDP - real growth rate;
Nao se endividaram ( provavelmente porque nao precisaram; )
resumindo :

 descontanto a responsabilidade dos povos do sul por despesismo   parece existir aqui um nexo de causalidade  entre um pais prosperar na zona euro e o seu grau de industrializacao;
e apontar como exemplos o sucesso  paises +  recentes que entraram na zona euro aos Holiday countrys   parece um pouco desonesto porque quase impossivel de seguir pelo menos no curto/medio prazo;

Eslovaquia :
GDP - composition by sector: agriculture: 3.1%
industry: 30.8%
services: 47% (2013 est.)

Estonia
GDP - composition by sector: agriculture: 3.9%
industry: 30%
services: 66.2% (2013 est.)

Grecia :

GDP - composition by sector: agriculture: 3.5%
industry: 16%
services: 80.5% (2013 est.)
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 17:52:33 por valves1 »
"O poder só sobe a cabeça quando encontra o local vazio."

Vanilla-Swap

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Zel

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6944 em: 2015-07-04 18:06:54 »
o obama esta a passar do fim-de-semana a arranjar o dinheiro para dar a grecia, deve estar quase quase a vestir o chapeu de pai natal ... 

entretanto porto-rico vai ser salvo pelos alemaes   :D
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 18:12:02 por Neo-Liberal »

Zel

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6945 em: 2015-07-04 18:10:34 »
o que o varoufakis escreveu quando apareceram rumores infundados sobre controlo de capitais na grecia :

« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 18:11:07 por Neo-Liberal »

Zel

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6946 em: 2015-07-04 18:13:06 »
ha quem chame a isto pensar sete passos a frente
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 18:14:36 por Neo-Liberal »

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6947 em: 2015-07-04 18:20:28 »
ha quem chame a isto pensar sete passos a frente

nunca te vejo especular um bocadinho, reflectir, apresentar um cenário possível, tentar ganhar uns passos ao tempo, criar, dar uma ideia nova, produzir algo de original.
por isso sabes quanto valem as tuas críticas? a big zero!

procura pensar pela tua cabeça, arriscar um um cenário possível, fazer um prognóstico.
put some skin in the game.

depois talvez alguém dê valor às tuas críticas.

L
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

Zel

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6948 em: 2015-07-04 18:30:25 »
ha quem chame a isto pensar sete passos a frente

nunca te vejo especular um bocadinho, reflectir, apresentar um cenário possível, tentar ganhar uns passos ao tempo, criar, dar uma ideia nova, produzir algo de original.
por isso sabes quanto valem as tuas críticas? a big zero!

procura pensar pela tua cabeça, arriscar um um cenário possível, fazer um prognóstico.
put some skin in the game.

depois talvez alguém dê valor às tuas críticas.

L

nao sao criticas, estou a brincar com tuas opinioes que me parecem exageros
eu tb acho que a grecia deve sair do euro, mas nao tenho a tua visao cor-de-rosa do syriza
e gosto de gozar  :D
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 18:33:17 por Neo-Liberal »

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6949 em: 2015-07-04 18:39:22 »
nao tenho a tua visao cor-de-rosa do syriza

não é cor de rosa...
é mesmo vermelha!

L
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

Zel

  • Visitante
Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6950 em: 2015-07-04 18:42:23 »
a grecia neste momento paga muito pouco pela sua divida. paga menos que paises como portugal, italia e espanha. como tal em vez de se estarem a focar numa coisa que de momento nao lhes causa problemas deveriam usar o seu tempo a resolver outros problemas mais prementes. e deveriam ter sobre isto um sentimento de urgencia.

mas nao o fazem. preferem uma batalha que de momento nao faz sentido nenhum. o facto de nao terem as suas prioridades claras prova que sao um pais que prefere nao resolver os seus problemas de forma seria, que nao se quer desenvolver. eh como o estudante que tem sempre desculpas e nunca estuda.
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 18:44:23 por Neo-Liberal »

Vanilla-Swap

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6951 em: 2015-07-04 18:49:57 »
a grecia neste momento paga muito pouco pela sua divida. paga menos que paises como portugal, italia e espanha. como tal em vez de se estarem a focar numa coisa que de momento nao lhes causa problemas deveriam usar o seu tempo a resolver outros problemas mais prementes. e deveriam ter sobre isto um sentimento de urgencia.

mas nao o fazem. preferem uma batalha que de momento nao faz sentido nenhum. o facto de nao terem as suas prioridades claras prova que sao um pais que prefere nao resolver os seus problemas de forma seria, que nao se quer desenvolver. eh como o estudante que tem sempre desculpas e nunca estuda.

1 paga menos ou nada o problema é que não paga,

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6952 em: 2015-07-04 19:00:30 »
a grecia neste momento paga muito pouco pela sua divida. paga menos que paises como portugal, italia e espanha. como tal em vez de se estarem a focar numa coisa que de momento nao lhes causa problemas deveriam usar o seu tempo a resolver outros problemas mais prementes. e deveriam ter sobre isto um sentimento de urgencia.

mas nao o fazem. preferem uma batalha que de momento nao faz sentido nenhum. o facto de nao terem as suas prioridades claras prova que sao um pais que prefere nao resolver os seus problemas de forma seria, que nao se quer desenvolver. eh como o estudante que tem sempre desculpas e nunca estuda.

não percebo.
O FMI afirma que a dívida é insustentável.
se o serviço da dívida na grécia é mais barato que em portugal, isso só significa que a nossa dívida é ainda mais insustentável.
idem para espanha e itália.

L
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

Automek

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6953 em: 2015-07-04 19:04:26 »
Citar
Economistas do Banco Real da Escócia publicaram nesta tarde um gráfico a mostrar o declínio dos depósitos bancários gregos nos últimos cinco anos, em comparação com Itália e Portugal.


https://twitter.com/RBS_Economics/status/616929611415441408/photo/1

Zel

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6954 em: 2015-07-04 19:09:29 »
a grecia neste momento paga muito pouco pela sua divida. paga menos que paises como portugal, italia e espanha. como tal em vez de se estarem a focar numa coisa que de momento nao lhes causa problemas deveriam usar o seu tempo a resolver outros problemas mais prementes. e deveriam ter sobre isto um sentimento de urgencia.

mas nao o fazem. preferem uma batalha que de momento nao faz sentido nenhum. o facto de nao terem as suas prioridades claras prova que sao um pais que prefere nao resolver os seus problemas de forma seria, que nao se quer desenvolver. eh como o estudante que tem sempre desculpas e nunca estuda.

não percebo.
O FMI afirma que a dívida é insustentável.
se o serviço da dívida na grécia é mais barato que em portugal, isso só significa que a nossa dívida é ainda mais insustentável.
idem para espanha e itália.

L

talvez estejam a contabilizar efeitos sobre a divida duma futura recapitalizacao dos bancos gregos ou a assumir que a grecia tera de voltar aos mercados. seria preciso ler o relatorio e eu nao tenho paciencia
mas olhando apenas para o peso presente do servico da divida nao ha problema nenhum de sustentabilidade

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6955 em: 2015-07-04 20:06:31 »
A hilarious Monty Python sketch explains why Greece is in a huge crisis

Many top English-speaking economists are either alarmed or aghast over Europe's handling of the crisis in Greece. Several Nobel Prize winners say it has been exacerbated, time and again, by an unnecessarily rigid approach by Germany, Europe's economic powerhouse and decision-maker. Greece simply cannot repay its debts, economists argue, no matter how much the country slashes public services or raises taxes. So by insisting it keep on trying, the thinking goes, Germany seems to be intent on punishing Greece.

The Germans see it differently, saying what they are doing may be painful, but necessary, to get the country on a sustainable footing for the long term. To understand the massive gap in opinion, it might help to watch a Monty Python sketch from 1974 about a soccer match between Germany and Greece.

In the match, the two countries are represented by their foremost philosophers. For much of the game, the two sides do nothing but talk. Then, in the final minute, there is movement. Socrates scores on the German goalie Gottfried Wilhelm Leibniz, who lived from 1646 to 1716, to win. The German philosophers G.W.F. Hegel, Immanuel Kant and Karl Marx then dispute the goal with the referee, Confucius.

"Hegel is arguing that the reality is merely an a priori adjunct of non-naturalistic ethics. Kant via the categorical imperative is holding that ontologically it exists only in the imagination," the announcer says. "Marx is claiming it was offside."

Here, watch for yourself:


! No longer available

 

It isn't clear whether these lines actually make any sense (although on the replay, Socrates does seem to have been offside). And it would be risky to infer too much symbolism from the sketch. Broadly speaking, though, Monty Python's writers suggest some of the larger concepts in German philosophy over the past three centuries — concepts which, in some ways, continue to influence German thinking about economic policy.

The basic question for all these thinkers is whether the patterns we see in the world around us really reflect patterns that exist in nature or are simply attempts by our minds to structure what we see. For many German philosophers, a key effort was to understand the principles governing societies.


This is a particular issue for economists, who seek patterns in the mass of statistics coming out of stock markets and labor surveys. It's not always enough, though, to look at how markets and prices behave and describe the mathematical patterns they seem to follow. In practice, there always seem to be exceptions to the rules, sometimes catastrophic ones, which suggest that those maybe patterns have more to do with our minds than the natural world itself.

"Anglo-Saxon economists are guided by the utilitarian philosophy of John Stuart Mill or Jeremy Bentham, asking merely if a policy works," The Economist recently wrote. "Germans side with Immanuel Kant, believing that nothing works except through law, and are horrified when the [European Central Bank] strays from its narrow mandate."

(It's worth noting that the Greeks have tried to appropriate the German philosopher, employing Kant's writings about doing what's right to argue against paying back unfair debts.)

Later German philosophers built on Kant's views. Hegel was concerned with the relationship between events, facts and history and the principles that guide them — what we'd call them the laws of economics and social science. Marx took up this debate in a way that contemporary readers might be more familiar with. For Marx, economics was what gave history purpose and direction. He believed that capitalism was a kind of a intrinsic idea that was shaping history — but one with internal contradictions that would inevitably result in a worldwide socialist revolution.

One of the key economic ideas in German philosophy — and, to be fair, that of other cultures as well — was that there was something unnatural about debt, indeed immoral. The German word schuld means both debt and guilt. As Foreign Affairs pointed out this year, one of Nietzsche's big works looked at the relationship between shame and debt. "In On the Genealogy of Morals, Nietzsche looked back to the 'oldest and most primitive' personal relationship between creditor and debtor as the origin of how 'one person first measured himself against another,'" author Kenneth Dyson wrote.


Later in the 20th century, German thinkers refined these ideas. Walter Eucken (1891-1950), an opponent of the Nazis and an economist who has been enormously influential in Germany since the Second World War, wanted to develop a comprehensive economic theory that could describe prices, investments, debts, monopolies and more in a comprehensive way — instead of as just a sequence of apparently random facts.

In particular, he took issue with the work of John Maynard Keynes (1883-1946) — the famous British economist who long dominated economic thinking in the English-speaking world — about how the government should respond to crises. Keynes believed that the government had to aggressively deal with each crisis as it happened by filling in the gap left by the private sector. It could so by reducing interest rates to stimulate economic activity or spending money directly to get the economy moving again.

"Thus economics is without a firm basis, always trying to catch up with events and always moving from one crisis to another," Eucken wrote in The Foundations of Economics, a 1940 book.

It was a direct echo of the differences between Kant and Mill.

Eucken saw markets as systems of rules and guiding principles and believed that government's responsibility was to establish these principles and to follow them. Those rules, he believed, should be designed to adjust the economy automatically to a crisis, so that policymakers could adhere to them even when things got bad.

In that respect, Eucken's thinking was similar to the American economist Milton Friedman's, who also believed that central banks should follow rules established in advance during times of crisis. Agreed-upon rules would limit the chance that policymakers would misjudge and set interest rates too high or too low as they tried to straighten out a wobbling economy. Both thinkers also felt that giving too much leeway to government officials limited citizens' liberty, and it was better to go by a system of clear, well-known rules.


Eucken's views are now known as ordoliberalism, and they're still very popular among German economists. A skepticism of debt is central to the philosophy, which many see influencing German policy today. As The Economist has explained in a brief history of ordoliberalism:

 This is an offshoot of classical liberalism that sprouted during the Nazi period, when dissidents around Walter Eucken, an economist in Freiburg, dreamed of a better economic system. They reacted against the planned economies of Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union. But they also rejected both pure laissez-faire and Keynesian demand management.

The result was a school that was close both in personal contacts and in its content to the Austrian school associated with Friedrich Hayek. The two shared a view that deficit spending for demand management was foolish. Ordoliberalism differed, however, in believing that capitalism requires a strong government to create a framework of rules which provide the order (ordo in Latin) that free markets need to function most efficiently.

From the original ordoliberals sprang one big idea for state intervention when cartels dominated the economy: a muscular antitrust policy. A second was a strict monetary policy that focused rigidly and exclusively on price stability. A third was the enforcement of Haftung, which means not just liability but also responsibility. Germany has tougher insolvency laws than America or Britain, for instance.

This showed up after the financial crisis of 2008. The Germans wrote a "debt brake" in their constitution, the Economist noted, that seeks to balance state and federal budgets, and they have tried to bring the philosophy to other European nations as well.

wapo
« Última modificação: 2015-07-04 20:44:55 por Lark »
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

Counter Retail Trader

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6956 em: 2015-07-04 20:08:52 »
o que o varoufakis escreveu quando apareceram rumores infundados sobre controlo de capitais na grecia :

Comentario tao engraçado do minorcerebrustauro....   em 15 dias pediram quantas vezes dinheiro?

Pai vou sair de casa mas tens que me continuar a sustentar , e se aparecerem calotes paga os por mim ok?

Estou tao farto deste Varoufakis e do Tsipras , e da ala esquerda de Portugal que consegue ser mais populista que o Socrates e o Costa juntos.

Eu que nem tenho partido politico em particular...

tommy

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6957 em: 2015-07-04 20:27:11 »
O tsipras e o varoufakis são exactamente o mesmo que o lark:

1º Nova Previsão;
2º Falham;
3º Inventam uma narrativa que explica a realidade do seu falhanço;
4º Voltar ao início.

Tudo isto ao mesmo tempo que exclamam:
"até agora...tudo como previsto"
"tudo como o guião.."
"no pasa nada"
"não me passa pela cabeça que seja de outra forma"

E depois puff... novo falhanço.  :D

Lark

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6958 em: 2015-07-04 20:30:02 »
Paul Krugman Is Right Again: It's The Euro Itself That Is The Problem


Sitting over here in Europe and watching the federasts worrying about whether their darling and delight, the euro, is going to survive the outcome of the Greek crisis is rather disconcerting. For they’ve still not grasped the basic point at issue here: it is the euro itself that is the problem, nothing else. What moves it all from disconcerting to howlingly frustrating is that they were told this, repeatedly, before the euro started. That for all their joy at ever greater European union they were simply sowing the seeds of the next economic disaster. And given what has happened in Spain, Ireland, Portugal and Greece in recent years disaster is not too strong a word. This is not our fathers’ recessions, this is much more akin to our grandfathers’ Depression. In fact, outside war or positively malevolent governance (like Mugabe’s Zimbabwe) it’s difficult to think of anywhere that has had an economic disaster to match these past few years in peripheral Europe. It wasn’t this bad for most of Europe in the Great Depression itself.

Paul Krugman points, quite rightly, to what is actually the problem, the euro itself:

Why are there so many economic disasters in Europe? Actually, what’s striking at this point is how much the origin stories of European crises differ. Yes, the Greek government borrowed too much. But the Spanish government didn’t — Spain’s story is all about private lending and a housing bubble. And Finland’s story doesn’t involve debt at all. It is, instead, about weak demand for forest products, still a major national export, and the stumbles of Finnish manufacturing, in particular of its erstwhile national champion Nokia .

What all of these economies have in common, however, is that by joining the eurozone they put themselves into an economic straitjacket. Finland had a very severe economic crisis at the end of the 1980s — much worse, at the beginning, than what it’s going through now. But it was able to engineer a fairly quick recovery in large part by sharply devaluing its currency, making its exports more competitive. This time, unfortunately, it had no currency to devalue. And the same goes for Europe’s other trouble spots.

Does this mean that creating the euro was a mistake? Well, yes.


Just to go back to basics here. We have both monetary policy and fiscal policy with which we can influence the economy. It’s not quite true but close enough to say that they can substitute for each other (no, let’s no go into the zero lower bound and all that, we’re being very simplistic here). It’s also true that different areas will have different economies. Manhattan’s economy is different from that of Queens, that of New Jersey is more different than that as against that of Louisiana, the economy of Greece is again more different than that from the economy of Germany and so on. The larger the area we consider the more we’re going to have sub-economies within that radically differ.

If things always stayed the same this wouldn’t matter. But they don’t: oil prices change, the weather does, technology changes. Different economies, these sub-economies, will react differently to those external changes (in the jargon, exogenous changes). And that’s fine, we’ve our monetary and fiscal policies with which we can manage them (please note here, I’m including currency exchange rates as monetary policy, which it can be).

Thinking of the US economy Texas with its oil is obviously reacting to the change in the crude oil price differently from Idaho, where they consume but don’t produce oil.

Our next stage is that if you’ve got one currency then you’ve got to also have one monetary policy. The basic interest rate is the same right over the US, just as it is right across the eurozone. So, in the US, when there’s one of those shocks only fiscal policy can be used to help one area that needs it. A lot of this is automatic, Federal taxes will decline (ie, less money is taken out of that local economy) when the local industry busts. And Federal spending will increase at the same time in that area. These are “automatic stabilisers” in the jargon.

And so what happens in Europe, in the eurozone? Well, we’ve got to have just the one interest rate because we’ve got just the one currency, that is, we can’t use monetary policy to help a specific region as we must set it for all. And yet we’ve not got fiscal policy across the entire region either. When the German economy was pretty sick (around 2000 to 2005) we had low interest rates for all because that’s what the largest economy in Europe needed. This set off massive property booms in both Spain and Ireland. And yet there wasn’t any tax collection from those booms which was then sent to Germany, as there would have been with a single fiscal space and policy. Then came the bust and those property booms collapsed: all the Irish and Spanish banks (I exaggerate, but only a little) went bust. By this time Germany was doing fine so interest rates were not reduced to zero: what the peripheral countries needed. But nor was there tax collection in Germany to send to those now poor countries.

This is the real and basic problem of the euro. We must have one monetary policy for the entire area. And yet the local economies are too disparate to be all run with one monetary policy alone. There must be a fiscal policy which covers the whole area to make it even possible that the eurozone will thrive in the long term. And we’ve not got it and we’re most unlikely to get it.

Thus the euro itself is simply a mistake. As Krugman says.

forbes
Be Kind; Everyone You Meet is Fighting a Battle.
Ian Mclaren
------------------------------
If you have more than you need, build a longer table rather than a taller fence.
l6l803399
-------------------------------------------
So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance.
Franklin D. Roosevelt

tommy

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Re: Grécia - Tópico principal
« Responder #6959 em: 2015-07-04 22:00:52 »
Citar
Conselho de Estado da Grécia considerou que o referendo é legal. Qual é a posição da Nova Democracia?
Como o Conselho de Europa afirmou, não é possível fazer um referendo no espaço de duas semanas. Além disso, este referendo era a última coisa de que o país precisava nesta altura. Era necessário chegar a um acordo para estabilizar a economia. Infelizmente, o Governo fez uma coisa impensável e que nunca foi vista no país. Os bancos estão fechados, temos controlo de capitais, a economia está parada, o turismo está totalmente destruído. Este Governo é responsável pela destruição total da economia grega.

Tsipras alega que o Governo foi forçado a impor o encerramento dos bancos depois de os credores recusarem prolongar o programa de assistência à Grécia.
Se o primeiro-ministro tivesse chegado a um acordo com a troika até 30 de junho, e teve mais do que tempo para o fazer porque passaram cinco meses desde que foi eleito, nada disto teria acontecido. Mas não encontrou uma solução, não conseguiu um acordo. A responsabilidade é dele. A Nova Democracia disponibilizou-se para se sentar à mesa por forma a chegar a um consenso e encontrar uma solução, mas este Governo não quis saber. Em consequência, pela primeira vez na história, os bancos estão fechados na Grécia.

A economia não estava já destruída em janeiro, quando a Nova Democracia deixou o Governo?
Quando chegámos ao Governo, em 2012, tínhamos um défice de 9% do PIB. Quando saímos, em janeiro, a economia estava a crescer 0,7% e o desemprego estava a começar a baixar. Estávamos a conseguir bons resultados. Agora destruíram completamente a economia. Qualquer pessoa compreende o que o encerramento dos bancos significa para uma economia. É o Governo mais catastrófico da história da Grécia.

É possível haver crescimento se forem aplicadas mais medidas de austeridade?
Primeiro é preciso chegar a um acordo, para que a economia recomece a funcionar. Estamos numa situação dramática. Precisamos de prosseguir com reformas estruturais, nomeadamente ao nível das privatizações e da redução da despesa do Estado. E temos de descer os impostos, especialmente no caso das empresas. Quando chegámos ao Governo tivemos de os aumentar porque tínhamos um défice de 9%, mas assim que tivemos oportunidade começámos a baixá-los, por exemplo no caso do IVA. O IVA dos restaurantes era 23% e, assim que a economia recomeçou a crescer, foi reduzido para 13%. Agora que chegámos a esta situação catastrófica é preciso um novo plano.

Para baixar os impostos às empresas é preciso ir buscar o dinheiro a outro lado... Qual é a proposta da Nova Democracia?
É preciso cortar a despesa do Estado. Não estou a falar das pensões, mas é possível encontrar outras formas.

O que acontecerá se o "Não" ganhar?
Sairemos do euro e será a catástrofe absoluta da economia grega. Mas isso não vai acontecer. O povo grego vai deixar uma mensagem clara de que queremos continuar a fazer parte da família europeia. 

Puseram-se com experimentalismos à lá bloco/syriza lixaram a economia toda. Merecem tudo o que lhes vai acontecer.
Agora têm idosos à porta de bancos a chorar. Bem melhor do que antigamente.

E ainda há aqueles que dizem que os syrizas pensam 7 passos à frente e devem andar 'felizes e descontraídos'.